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    • PULL Archiving   07/22/20

      Hi all, I paid the server bill for the month so the site can be archived, sorry for the mess, didn't realize there'd be such an uproar. The site's in read-only mode. Happy archiving. Here's a link to a user-made PULL discord server: https://discord.gg/vZFEm75

Cryaotic and the Late Night Crew


167 posts in this topic

Posted

no wonder why pewdiepie doesn’t associate with him anymore. dude went down a rabbit hole and never came out from it. 

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Posted

I might be biased because I've gone through a similar-ish situation, but I can understand Chey's behavior back then to a certain extent. Imagine having an older boyfriend that groomed you since you were 16 and then you find out he cheated on you with his underage fans... Of course, that doesn't mean that the verbal abuse that Cry and his friends received was justified. In reality, she just needed to leave that situation ASAP. While I believe that the victims in this situation are justified in expressing how they feel in the way they think is best, I think it would actually be best for Chey to post a concise statement instead of going back and forth with people from the LNC and being all over the place. Based on some reactions I've read in other places, I think people essentially think she "doesn't count" because of her past and her behavior. :alpacaworry:

I'm glad to see that most (?) of Cry's friends seem to be siding with the victims. I don't really know how to feel over Jund essentially admitting he was willing to let "one creepy thing" slide for the sake of financial stability. If you're depending on a friend to the point you might be "homeless" without him, shouldn't you be questioning what you're doing with your life? It's a little fishy but I don't see any point in tracking down every single person associated with Cry to see whether or not they were aware. Because at the end of the day, it's Cry who took advantage of minors and he should be the first one to be held accountable. 

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Posted

This said, there is one thing that perplexes me more than makes me dubious: everyone seems to be pretty much on board with throwing Cryaotic under the bus.Aside from his hand-holding net of die-hard fans, each and one of his friends have either attested against him or straight up publicly made known they believed the victims. It's a big step up but if we look behind to a not-so-old story of similar entity (a.k.a. the ProJared fiasco), some of his friends and recurring streaming buddies did support him for a period of time before everything eventually came crashing down.

 

The fact that he openly admitted to it, and the victims have spoken out pretty makes it clearcut true. It's not a "he said she said" situation, there's full acknowledgements from both sides that it happened. He did that. That's why I think a lot of people are "throwing him under the bus." (I don't really like that term because it implies he doesn't deserve it, which to be honest, he does) This isn't like ProJared where it's two people arguing, or like Slazo where it's two sides fighting. He straight up admitted this, with only a slight push from Cheyenne considering a tweet she posted in January.

Honestly, I hate to be pessimistic, but there seems to be a reoccurring theme with youtubers like this being outed as pedophiles and predators, so I wasn't really alarmed to hear this news when at this rate I wouldn't be surprised by anything. 

I might be biased because I've gone through a similar-ish situation, but I can understand Chey's behavior back then to a certain extent. Imagine having an older boyfriend that groomed you since you were 16 and then you find out he cheated on you with his underage fans... Of course, that doesn't mean that the verbal abuse that Cry and his friends received was justified. In reality, she just needed to leave that situation ASAP. While I believe that the victims in this situation are justified in expressing how they feel in the way they think is best, I think it would actually be best for Chey to post a concise statement instead of going back and forth with people from the LNC and being all over the place. Based on some reactions I've read in other places, I think people essentially think she "doesn't count" because of her past and her behavior. :alpacaworry:

 

This is something that's bothering me too. Her shitty behaviour isn't at all excusable and she was very verbally abusive but she was groomed as a child by this man who admitted to cheating on her with other minors. She was with him till she was what - 21+? Her entire developmental years were with him and I really wouldn't be surprised if she lashed out like that because of what was going on. It explains her actions, but it doesn't justify it, and at the end of the day she's still a victim too, whether she was a bitch or not. Her shitty attitude won't change the fact that they started dating when she was 16 when he was already 20+(? I think) People who are dicks are still victims too, even if they're a massive asshole. She's allowed to be a victim in this scenario, but people hate to see that because of her actions as an adult.

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Posted

I can't seem to stop thinking about this whole thing...

I keep wondering what the hell Cry expected to happen after he posted that video? Judging by the fact that he was ready to jump back into another LNC stream pretty much immediately, I think it's fair to assume that he thought people would be supportive of him?! Which is just so confusing?!?? You just admitted to grooming and pedophilia, my dude, there's a 0% chance everyone will just tell you they're proud of you for being honest and then move on.

He also previously mentioned in another tweet that he wanted to play TLOU2 on his channel, but that he needed to make another important video first (which turned out to be the shitty apology video). Again, insinuating that he assumes he could just go back to posting regular content after that?! 

Anyway, I thought it would be helpful to compile the reactions of the rest of the LNC and some of his friends (?).

Jund:

Hidden Content

Russ:

Hidden Content

Tolo:

Hidden Content

Snake (hasn't made a tweet, but talked with Chey a bunch):

Hidden Content

Angel:

Hidden Content

Dodger:

Hidden Content

Let me know if I forgot anyone, I don't really know everyone Cry is/was acquainted with.

 

i think he knows he's got a really loyal fanbase who's been with him for the last decade. maybe he thought if he just mentioned the grooming part quickly and focused more on his mental health status lately, they'd criticise his actions but move on and he could go back to the way things were before? cuz tbh i've seen tweets from his people saying "you're still learning and growing, at least you admitted to it and you didn't do anything technically illegal so it's ok i'll still watch your videos" so i guess sadly that's how some people actually did react :// i even saw one person say they "admired" cry for admitting to what he did

also, manga mix (it's been a while but i think they collab'd before?) made a vague tweet but she didn't name cry specifically or even describe what terrible thing happened. she just said "Disappointed and saddened by the news regarding members of the streaming community. I applaud those of you who have been brave enough to speak up and talk about such a terrible thing. To those of you who aren't just know that people are listening if/when you are ready to share."

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Posted (edited)

People said a theory for why he doesn't show his face is because of his intentions. I think it's also because he believes in "the power of radio" but I wouldn't be surprised if it was the latter.

Edit: I forgot about the LNC panel at TwitchCon and Snake who was anonymous revealed his face, even fans were surprised because they always perceived him as White since Solid Snake is a White character. So this makes it suspicious why Cry never shows his face.

Edited by anonymouskid
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Posted

The fact that he openly admitted to it, and the victims have spoken out pretty makes it clearcut true. It's not a "he said she said" situation, there's full acknowledgements from both sides that it happened. He did that. That's why I think a lot of people are "throwing him under the bus." (I don't really like that term because it implies he doesn't deserve it, which to be honest, he does) This isn't like ProJared where it's two people arguing, or like Slazo where it's two sides fighting. He straight up admitted this, with only a slight push from Cheyenne considering a tweet she posted in January.

 

I'm not a native english speaker so I apologize if the phrase "throwing him under the bus" came off the wrong way (which might be why two people have been downvoting every post I've made in the thread even when I just posted a screenshot of Ziegs saying stuff to elaborate better on the LNC's position, lol) but yes, he totally deserves the public guillotine he is getting: he has been such a big part of many people's lives (some going as far as saying that they looked up to him and that his behavior helped them not commit suicide or self-harm, or that they discovered their identity thanks to him and such things) that he deserves to be put under public scrutiny and for his victims to be recognized as such.

I never said I would excuse/condone/see as any less than the threat it is or look nicely towards at what Cry has done, neither that the victims need to forgive them or have no cause to behave in a certain way.

I still believe the LNC should be held (the people who allowed this predatory behavior to slide) accountable for allowing this behavior to continue on: Ziegs might have send that post from her Tumblr but there is barely any recognition beyond that after she tossed a stone saying "at least two people knew of it".

 

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Posted

Cry did refer to himself as a manchild. I do think you can be socially stunted and the early twenties, for a man who didn't grow up to be socialized, can definitely fall under that weird "barely adult, barely mature" mindset -- kind of like how being 18 (or 21) doesn't magically turn you into an adult overnight. I feel like this can extend to the mid twenties and create patterns where you turn into a predator because you're emotionally unable to grow past the confidence boost of teenagers being into you.
I do appreciate your take on this though, like. It doesn't excuse anything, of course not, but there's food for thoughts.

 

Yes, exactly! Thank you for understanding and wording this better than I did haha 
Cry's fans have always had their own imaginings of who Cry is as a person and now all of those dreams are being crushed, so it's interesting to try to work out who he really is in the light of all this new information and what's lead him to do these awful life choices. There's a lot of people sympathizing with him too and I truly do understand it, because Cry has lead a pretty miserable life based on all that we know about his family situation, his mental health and his other personal relationships. The entire LNC and others associated all dropped him like a hat and claims to not have even been friends with him in a long time, if ever and I find it pretty sad tbh. In a way this can been seen as irony or tragedy, Cry is repeating an unhealthy loop that his mother did, the abused becomes the abuser etc. 

Speaking of the LNC, I don't know what to make out of them since some of the members and associates are saying conflicting things in regards to all of this. Jund said that he only knew of Cry sexting with a 16 year old back in the day while Ziegs stated on tumblr that they knew of 2 cases? Snake stated that he didn't know anything before until he saw Chey's tweet (tweeted this year January) about being cheated on with a 16 year old back in the day, which was obviously about Cry, but chose not to react. So uh? How long have they all been sitting on this info? I know that since the guys were all financially dependent on Cry it must've been difficult to really make a big deal out of it, but it still seems a bit off to me. I'm not sure how much I can trust any of them and what they say, because it feels a bit like they're trying to cover for themselves. But this is just a feeling I have. 

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Posted

Okay, PULL glitched for me and I couldn't read the other posts about the LNC until now. It's becoming more clear that they knew something was up but chose not to act on it, and that is pretty disappointing. Now I feel like even if they continue without Cry, why should people even support them knowing that they could have done something about this much sooner? Anyways, it seems like there's more information that we don't know yet, so I'm going to wait for that (if they even decide to say it). 

Also, I completely disagree with anything that has to do with the idea that Cry wasn't "aware" that what he was doing was "grooming." I think that's a bit dangerous, because there is no way an adult was clueless about the power dynamics in play when it comes to talking to underage fans. It's a bit annoying that people rather argue that he didn't have "evil intentions" rather than just simply find his actions fucked up. I think people are way too attached to his persona of being this "soft / chill dude" that their perceptions of him are completely warped. The cognitive dissonance...

Mental health issues, a messed up family background, stunted growth.... While all of these may have contributed to his current behavior, there's still NO EXCUSE for an adult to enter themselves in a situation they know they shouldn't have. I'm tired of seeing people give this grown man a break.

I have mental health issues and I still feel like a child sometimes too, but I never thought about talking to a minor sexually lmao?? The moment I see an underage dude in my DMs it's an instant block. :alpacamad:

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Posted

despite how much i shit on him in my previous post i really do agree with you, i dont think that he did any of this with the INTENTION of grooming anyone, but he also never took the time to look back and think about the power that he held over these people (him being a "celebrity" and older than them). I dont even think he went after these people for the fact that he just liked younger kids, maybe he just coudnt get along with people his age and conected better with them but in the end he still should have looked to get help from other places and looked for company in other places :/

 

Whether he intentionally groomed these people I cannot say, he definitely was aware of the youtuber/fan power dynamic though and of the age gap power dynamic at least during the moment when he found out the girls were 16. You can be aware of the power you hold over others while simultaneously thinking badly of yourself. I do agree that Cry most likely didn't go after teens because they were teens specifically, if a bunch 20+yo girls from his fandom had approached him romantically/sexually I think he would've taken that validation all the same. But these are all just my own speculations and I could be wrong! The things Cry did though are definitely still wrong and no mental illness justifies it, but it is still quite sad for all parties involved.

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Posted (edited)

OMFG. What in the world did I just read?
https://twitter.com/Russ_Money/status/1275578326330081282?s=20
Twitlonger link on the tweet: https://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1sr9mg5

I was wondering out loud in my previous post about why Angel and Russ drifted away from Cry just to make a point that; we all thought we knew what was going on with how they were doing on streams, when in reality that's not how things work. But holy shit, I didn't realise things were this bad behind the scenes.

I always felt a little weird with how Cry started making all these content with Angel, just a while after Russ had introduced her with Angel. And it did seem here and there that Russ felt weird with how quickly the two grew really close together but I guess we former fans never thought to much about it because we personally rarely saw how Russ and Angel interacted without Cry around, and Cry started making more collabs with Angel right after he broke up -- so everyone just thought Angel was being a really good friend for Cry.

Holy shit, this is really mortifying to read, I really really feel bad towards Russ for having been involved with these people. I might not know the full details but this is so scummy

Edited by hoshizawa
pull glitching
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Posted

Also, I completely disagree with anything that has to do with the idea that Cry wasn't "aware" that what he was doing was "grooming." I think that's a bit dangerous, because there is no way an adult was clueless about the power dynamics in play when it comes to talking to underage fans.

 

I personally am sorry if it came off as if I implied he wasn't aware and I want to state that I'm not arguing what he did was wrong. I don't want to invalidate the hurt he's done, because that would just be as fucked up.

But I do however believe he should work on those issues if he wants to go on with a better approach to life, and learn to be better as he claims he wants to be. Not that there is a redemption arc for him, just that he shouldn't get to live again through the pattern of being an abuser and a liar (on the account of having "excuses" that could be related to his own issues)

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Posted

OMFG. What in the world did I just read?
https://twitter.com/Russ_Money/status/1275578326330081282?s=20
Twitlonger link on the tweet: https://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1sr9mg5

I was wondering out loud in my previous post about why Angel and Russ drifted away from Cry just to make a point that; we all thought we knew what was going on with how they were doing on streams, when in reality that's not how things work. But holy shit, I didn't realise things were this bad behind the scenes.

I always felt a little weird with how Cry started making all these content with Angel, just a while after Russ had introduced her with Angel. And it did seem here and there that Russ felt weird with how quickly the two grew really close together but I guess we former fans never thought to much about it because we personally rarely saw how Russ and Angel interacted without Cry around, and Cry started making more collabs with Angel right after he broke up -- so everyone just thought Angel was being a really good friend for Cry.

Holy shit, this is really mortifying to read, I really really feel bad towards Russ for having been involved with these people. I might not know the full details but this is so scummy

 

Didn't Cry and Angel encourage the fanbase to ship them during streams or something along those lines? Angel and Cry both being scummy isn't any news in my book, so I'm not really sure if this proves anything that we already didn't know. I remember people talking about how shady it was that Angel was introduced to the group by Russ, but then dropped him for Cry. If she didn't feel the same way towards Russ then I can understand the discomfort and distancing, but still playing with his emotions while messing with Cry? that's low... 
I think the takeaway here is that Cry is a shit friend. :alpacafedup:

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Posted

I personally am sorry if it came off as if I implied he wasn't aware and I want to state that I'm not arguing what he did was wrong. I don't want to invalidate the hurt he's done, because that would just be as fucked up.

But I do however believe he should work on those issues if he wants to go on with a better approach to life, and learn to be better as he claims he wants to be. Not that there is a redemption arc for him, just that he shouldn't get to live again through the pattern of being an abuser and a liar (on the account of having "excuses" that could be related to his own issues)

Oh no! You don't need to apologize. I'm sorry that it came off that I was talking about your post. I didn't get the impression that you were excusing his actions, but I can see now how it seemed like I was talking about you. :alpacaworry2:  My post was directed more at people on twitter who firmly believe that he didn't know what he was doing. Like I've said before, he definitely needs to go to therapy and stop streaming if he wants to better himself. 

OMFG. What in the world did I just read?
https://twitter.com/Russ_Money/status/1275578326330081282?s=20
Twitlonger link on the tweet: https://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1sr9mg5

I was wondering out loud in my previous post about why Angel and Russ drifted away from Cry just to make a point that; we all thought we knew what was going on with how they were doing on streams, when in reality that's not how things work. But holy shit, I didn't realise things were this bad behind the scenes.

I always felt a little weird with how Cry started making all these content with Angel, just a while after Russ had introduced her with Angel. And it did seem here and there that Russ felt weird with how quickly the two grew really close together but I guess we former fans never thought to much about it because we personally rarely saw how Russ and Angel interacted without Cry around, and Cry started making more collabs with Angel right after he broke up -- so everyone just thought Angel was being a really good friend for Cry.

Holy shit, this is really mortifying to read, I really really feel bad towards Russ for having been involved with these people. I might not know the full details but this is so scummy

The cheating thing isn't too surprising as it's been speculated for a while, but I'm definitely shocked that Russ went public and told his side of the story. (And now I have a reason to dislike Angel too lol.) Good on him, but this is only revealing that pretty much most of LNC has their own set of issues. Reading this reminded me of drama from high school...only to realize these people are all adults. Yikes. Thinking about how many fans claimed that the LNC was their safe space makes me feel icky now. 

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http://www.twitlonger.com/show/n_1sr9mi8

Angel replied. At least she admits to being scummy and taking advantage of Cry's fame and status. She'd also heard the rumors about Cry previously, huh... 
It's smart of her to step down from streaming tho', I'll give her that.

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Posted

Didn't Cry and Angel encourage the fanbase to ship them during streams or something along those lines? Angel and Cry both being scummy isn't any news in my book, so I'm not really sure if this proves anything that we already didn't know. I remember people talking about how shady it was that Angel was introduced to the group by Russ, but then dropped him for Cry. If she didn't feel the same way towards Russ then I can understand the discomfort and distancing, but still playing with his emotions while messing with Cry? that's low... 
I think the takeaway here is that Cry is a shit friend. :alpacafedup:

 

Good to know that people in the fanbase never looked past these shady behaviours. All I know is that the youtube comments were really wholesome then which I guess is due to the fact that some of these fans didn't follow Russ' non-LNC content to realise that Angel had been already around with him in D&D and all that.

I agree with your takeaway, the fact that Cry was "emotionally involved" with people Russ cared about speaks volume. Not going to look past Red and Angel's side as well, the fact that they strung along is just disgusting. I really feel sorry for him.

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